Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 13:17
It’s funny, I’m watching the series Tires on Netflix. I don’t know if you guys have seen that, but the manager head manager is always like in the corner, kind of like practicing, you know, like before he goes out to the customer. So it just makes me think of that. Walk through how it works a little bit. So a client onboards on this, how does it work technically? Is someone speaking directly in because I could see here there’s, there’s a bunch of, you know, there’s, you know, scenarios here with practice. There’s also Enter Arena, you know, Find the Need, earn the question, or Earn the Next Question. Get Them Curious. How does it work technically when they go in on your platform?
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 14:03
Well, what you’re looking at, there are generic scenarios, and this is something that we’ve made just to showcase the capabilities of the platform. The real power comes from you being able to model any situation that you know, that you or your reps or your employees might encounter. So that’s the first thing that happens. You, you’re onboarded and then you start creating your own scenarios.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 14:28
So was like a sales manager and Hinrik in this case, be like, here’s like the ideal way I want this handled. And they upload it and it compares it against practice or.
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 14:38
That’s one way that’s usually how it starts. But just like Paul said, there’s an opportunity cost to leaving the sales managers the bottleneck. So the platform is flexible enough so that anyone using it can model their own scenario. So if you’re going on a call in ten minutes that you might read or might be a little bit nervous for, or you just want to show up a little bit better prepared and you can model that scenario and then you can practice a few times and, and hopefully reap better results.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 15:10
So when you practice a few times, are you pressing something inside your platform? And then does it give you spit back advice to you verbally or in text? How does that work? The feedback work?
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 15:25
Yeah, you get the conversation is just a voice interaction with an AI, and it’s realistic enough to elicit emotional response to rejections. And you know, whatever emotions might be, might be prevailing in that conversation, but the feedback is mostly in text. It also shows you graphics of, you know, where your strengths and weaknesses are. But the point is to make it as actionable as possible. So none of the feedback is going to be like, you know, you need to, you know, take a course and then come back in six months.
It’s just try this thing next time. And that’s how you incrementally improve. But there is an aspect here that is quite, quite important to mention is that all of this needs to happen in a safe environment and it needs to happen in an environment where you believe and trust in the feedback that you’re getting. And that is, I would say, 95% of what we’re doing because talking to an AI is not difficult these days. I can open pretty much any AI chat chatbot and this may be a difficult customer.
And then I’m role playing. The value here is created in the feedback. And we have devised a way to make that feedback consistent and comparable over time and over teams. So you’re not just creating a practicing environment where people feel like they’re safe and where they can, you know, grow and become better. You’re creating a decision support system for those that need to take decisions on how to maneuver the organization.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 17:19
For a company using it, what do they, are there certain rules or, or audios that they have to input into the system to have kind of best practices for that? I’m sure, like you’re pulling all best practices in your platform already there. What is a company input to get started so that it kind of follows? Oh, well, we handle this this way.
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 17:42
They bring their insights into the situations that need to be trained. And most of those are built on past experiences. They bring information about the people that they’re interacting with, and the more information they can provide, the more accurate the role play is going to be. But they also bring in their own methodologies, their own processes. For example, we recently explored the case where a company was using the map pixels methodology. So that was modeled inside the scenarios. And that is completely customizable by anyone that uses the platform.
Paul Burani: 18:23
Yeah. Just to build on that, you know, Jeremy, you could think of it almost like a pyramid. So ground level would be you come into the platform and you have an idea of what you want this scenario to look like. Maybe you know how these customers respond to the pitch. And so you prompt the AI and it spins up a pretty lifelike scenario.
The next level up would be in the user interface, the ability to drag and drop. So maybe you pull in an objection handling reference document or a pitch deck. Maybe technical product materials, something to further train the AI. But really the sort of highest level, what we’re looking at as the best user experience is to remove as much friction from scenario creation as possible. And that means integrating with other technologies.
And so that’s where there is so much innovation happening right now in the industry of sales tech. You know, from the CRM to the data platforms to message deployment to all of the different little cottage industries that add up to real leading edge innovation in sales and revenue organizations. And so imagine, you know, you’re using one tool like Gong, for example, to record all of your calls, extract the insights, find the patterns and then with the flick of a wrist, inform your scenarios. You know, we’re looking at all of these different types of adjacent technologies to try to string together a seamless experience, not only to make it easy on our customer, but to improve not only the efficiency, but also the efficacy, because a 90% realistic scenario is great, but 99% is even better, and maybe 99.9 is right around the corner. So that’s really kind of what’s driving our vision.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 20:24
I want to talk about a few specific examples. I do want to point, if people want to check this out, they can go to atlasprimer.com and check out the Roleplay. And you could actually explore this a little bit.
They have 21 scenarios right now here, elevator pitch, sales call training, job interview, difficult customer training. And you can view details practice. So just check those out on the website. But a specific example, maybe talk about, I know you help a lot of different types of industries. You know, maybe specifically in manufacturing in the food space.
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 21:02
Yeah. There’s one example that comes to mind and it’s related to just how you can keep preparing, even though you’re at the top of your game. And we recently had the opportunity to, to learn from some of their, you know, incredibly accomplished sales leaders. And they are iterating a lot while practicing for trade shows. So the methodology here is not to try to, you know, sell the whole product at once, but incrementally get them to engage a little bit more.
So the first interaction is just to get them to come and check out the booth. And you usually have very limited time. So the role plays, they can be set to last a minute. So you have just one minute to work with, and you have to deliver something that is so compelling that you get people to say, hey, okay, that sounds great. I’m going to check out the booth later.
And then you just iterate on that and you practice, and then you increase the difficulty and you’re moving up the hierarchy in the company that you’re, you’re targeting. So you might start with, with the, you know, production managers and then you’re talking to the CFO and you’re always trying to get them to just do this one incremental investment of their time by coming to your booth. But this is just like any skill that can be trained and mastered. The more often you do it, the more different objections you encounter, the better the defense you build for it and the more easy it’s going to be to maneuver this in a natural, intuitive way when you’re when you find yourself in that actual situation.
Paul Burani: 22:57
And you know, this is, this is another way to illustrate sort of the front office versus the back office benefits, right? So as Hinrik was saying, just merely being more effective in these environments with thousands of leaders of the industry convening in one convention center, it’s a golden opportunity to make a lasting impression. And I think that’s very easily understandable. But what’s equally compelling is, think about how this looks to the C-suite, certainly the CFO, right? They look at that budget and they say, all right, this is a midsize company putting 30, 50, $100,000 into a trade show.
That’s the hard cost, to say nothing of all of the time that goes into preparing for these shows. I mean, if you add the fully loaded cost, you’re looking oftentimes well into the six figures. And what’s the output or what’s the return, that is? Well, at the end of the show you got a long list of leads and somebody’s going to have the job of conducting all the follow up. You better hope you made a good impression. And a lot of times it takes weeks, months, even years to actually realize that return or even have a sense of is there a path to ROI?
I used to go to a lot of these global trade shows where we would still be conducting follow ups from last year’s show, when it was time to start making plans for next year’s show. And so what we’re also trying to do is create objectivity in this. And that means if we can measure before the big event, how are people doing at nailing the narrative, hitting all the points in the pitch, being prepared for every single objection that’s coming? It becomes a sort of an insurance policy and it becomes a lot easier to invest in these somewhat, you know, nebulous opportunities with an unclear path to ROI when you just have a little more data, a little more objectivity in that process.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 25:01
Yeah. I mean, it is crazy how much a company will spend on a trade show. I think like, yeah, a trade show module, any company going to trade shows is a lot should check out the platform. I would say like front and center, just here’s the trade show module that we go with because I was talking to someone about this last week and you’re right. Well, there’s, there’s probably spending over six figures just with the booth and flying people there and the hotel and the food. And that’s, you know, all the team’s time. It’s incredible.
So and, and Hinrik, to your point, I think of the same thing in copywriting, right? So I think that what you said was really instructive, which is what’s the next action someone, you want someone to get right? It’s not like selling the product. It’s like, first you need to get them in the booth, then you need to do this. Then you need to do this. It’s not like you know all at once.
And one of my favorite books by Joe Sugarman, it just simplified for me copywriting, which is similar to what you said. He’s like, what’s the goal of the headline to get in the subheadline? What’s the goal of the subheadline to get them the first sentence? What’s the goal of the first sentence to get them the second and so on, right? I’m like, oh yeah, that makes sense. So if the headline sucks, they’re not getting any subhead. If the subhead is terrible, same thing with you. If like trying, they may not even realize, okay, I just need to get them to the booth and they’re focusing on something else. So I love what you said there. So that’s one scenario. I know you have other scenarios. I’m curious how there’s someone in the travel industry. How are they using Atlas Primer?
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 26:47
Well, there is, you know, people, people get very emotional about their vacations. This is, you know, a luxury that people appreciate. So when it goes wrong, it can get very emotional. So operating a service desk in the travel industry is a challenge. And there are examples where new service reps are not allowed to, you know, take incoming calls from customers for the first 3 or 4 months because they just need to, you know, they need to need to practice.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 27:28
Make the scenario worse. Like, yeah, I’m looking at your site here. If you’re looking at the tourism’s like re booking a storm canceled Golden Circle tour at Gray Line Iceland. Right. So there’s a bunch of scenarios here.
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 27:41
Exactly. And we’ve seen that the ramp time for new service reps has been cut down from three four months to two three weeks. And it’s just by giving people the exposure to pretty much anything that can happen, and anything that can happen is basically based on the knowledge of the people already in the organization, and they know what to prepare the newcomers for. And they can create these scenarios so that they can get exposure to pretty much anything that can be thrown at them, and then they can get the tools to navigate it successfully.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 28:19
It’s so true. I mean, we were in Mexico last year and it’s a long day of travel. So they were like, okay, your room will be ready in an hour, which is fine. I’m a pretty patient person, but then two hours, then three hours and I’m getting impatient here, right? Like, because we already spent ten hours traveling somewhere and now you’re waiting an extra 3 or 4 hours and it’s if that person handling it wrong can make it better or they can make it worse. So I. Totally true. And I love some of these scenarios here that you have. What about and there’s a med tech also I saw in there. Well how are people using it in the med tech and pharma?
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 29:07
Well, there’s, the sales cycles in medtech and pharma are notoriously complex. Multi stakeholders and you have to navigate a lot of different individuals along the way. And it’s hard to have the skill set, you know, to engage everyone equally well. But through role playing and this is, this is something that we’ve experienced. Paul and I, we were invited to, to a quarterly sales training, on site meeting for a company and in this space. And, there we saw firsthand some of the challenges that they’re facing.
And we also saw how valuable it can be to train these scenarios to, to brush up on your, on your small talk skills before you talk to the practice manager or to brush up on your technical. You know, the technical specifications before you, before you encounter the actual, you know, the user of the product and just having different scenarios where you can practice these different skills, if you will. This proved to be really impactful, but it’s hard to do that when you’re just interfacing with your, with your colleagues or your managers, or you’re just imagining how this is going to kind of play out. So having an environment where you can get these interactions is extremely powerful.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 30:44
Yeah, it’s really interesting. I’m looking here. It’s like introducing a new Medtronic device to a busy cardiologist. Cardiologist office. Right. There’s some real world scenarios here. This is fascinating. First of all, I have one last question before I ask it. I want to thank both of you, just sharing the journey and about Atlas Primer for people to check out. I guess it’s a two part question. One is I want to know, you know, how you two met in the first place? And how that come about?
Paul Burani: 31:19
So we met in a Slack community called Future of Higher Ed. And it was at a time when I had just sort of turned the page on my corporate career, was exploring and consulting and, you know, looking at interesting founder opportunities. It’s a community where a lot of people are looking at traditional education and the, you know, fast pace of change, you know, forces external and internal alike. And so I think Hinrik, you know, we just started talking and realized, you know, we both are looking forward and really far into the future and then also excited about the opportunities that are close at hand.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 32:08
The second part of that is just like, I know you met through different communities. What other communities have you heard or found valuable? It could be online. It could be in person. I know for me, if you have certain mentors or communities that have been helpful for for each of you, like I’ve been a part of one of became a good friend, Brian Kurtz’s Titans Group for, for many years, I’ve been a part of Jason Swenk’s group mastermind for agencies for many years.
I just find these online. And actually Paul and I met through the Connective, right, which is an online community that we’re both a part of. So I’m curious if, you know, either of you have, maybe it could be an individual mentor or a community that you find that is helpful, been helpful for you in this journey.
Hinrik Jósafat Atlason: 33:04
Well, I mean, as a venture backed company, we, we’ve had the privilege to work with some really incredible people. And we’ve been very fortunate to have investors that are not just, you know, cheque writers, but they also have communities behind them. And, you know, to use the opportunity to give a shout out to Entrepreneurs Roundtable Accelerator in New York City, who have just been an amazing venue for us to meet incredible people. And that’s actually where we met our third co-founder who’s not here with us today. And it’s just it’s so valuable to be part of a community where you can get inspired and where you can, where you can meet people that are not afraid to think outside the box.
And I just want to second what Paul said. We met through a community online, but we quickly connected on, on, you know, our shared vision for, you know, something marvelous that was going to happen. And we’ve been, we’ve been keeping each other excited ever since about the prospects of what we’re doing. And the, we’re at an inflection point. And I know I’m not going to start reciting, you know the typical sales pitch about how AI is transforming everything. We all know that it’s transforming a lot. But what Paul and I have been discussing a lot. Both, you know, as we work together on Atlas Primer and also before that is that there is a human aspect that is often overlooked.
And before we, you know, saw this through the lens of education technology, through the learning assistant, that would make learning more individualistic and inherently a little bit more accessible, allowing more people to, to reach their full potential. Now we see AI automating a lot around us, but we also see a lot of potential for AI to help us double down on what makes us human, what makes what gives us the true competitive advantage. And we see this in sales meetings. We send automated emails, we send, we do a lot of research with AI. But when it comes down to the decision, we’re often finding ourselves in a steakhouse on martini number 2 or 3, and that’s where the human connection is made. And that’s what I think is really, really exciting. And I love having had the opportunity to meet with people that are not just excited about the potential of AI, but also what it means for us as humans and how we can create an advantage for ourselves.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 36:04
I want to be the first one to thank you both. This is great. Everyone can check out AtlasPrimer.com to learn more and poke around the site. There’s a really, really cool cases there and you can explore that.
So thank you both so much. This was great.
Paul Burani: 36:21
It’s been a pleasure. Thank you so much.
