Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 16:14
I need you to triple the number of patients we have in December.
Cameron LiButti: 16:17
Yeah. We are. I loosely know numbers, but I’m not going to share those. But yeah, we are responsible for approximately one third of his revenue over the last five years, Bidview. And so with him he came in, he said I need to do what you did for John.
I said, okay, and this is where like the strategy stuff started with him. So two things happened. I said, okay, I need access to your website. He said, yeah, no problem. And then he was talked to this person in my office and she says, oh, that website’s broken. What do you mean, it’s broken? He told me, like, I can have access to it, you know, I don’t know. I don’t know who told you that. You can’t have it like it doesn’t work. Okay. What are we going to do? I don’t know, he’s like. Like she was just like, I don’t know, I didn’t. You didn’t hire, I didn’t hire you. He did. And so that’s when we started building websites. Long road of building websites, different ways to do it, how to do it, how to work with clients and that, you know, that.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 17:17
That makes sense also because like one, if you’re sending traffic to a page that’s not optimized for conversion, then they’re just paying for traffic to go into the ether. Right. And so same thing with building the proper content on it so that it leads to an action from someone. You know, I’ve gone to websites, even doctors. Like how do I find the contact? Like why is there not a contact thing? I can just easily call them. I mean, that’s what I’m looking to do. So.
Cameron LiButti: 17:50
Or hours or. Yeah. Where are they located?
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 17:53
And I’m going to bounce off of it. I mean, people have a short attention span.
Cameron LiButti: 17:57
Oh, yeah. I have a great story about bouncing off of websites where I come back to in a second. But that’s when it’s like the, that’s when like the strategy of Bidview clicks. So you just read off all the things we do very rarely. I can’t even remember the last time someone came to us and said, I need this, do this service. They usually come to me and they’re like, hey, we heard about you. Can you help? And then all the questions pour like, how are you getting business now? What is your customer acquisition cost? Nobody knows that. All those questions follow.
And so you know, we have a medical practice in the Carolinas. She’s on a bunch of islands. She has about 12,000 people in her town. Like, I don’t know. Name’s Meg. Meg, I can’t. We have to get outside of the town. SEO SEO will win. But you only have 12,000 people versus, you know, the medical practice that we have in, like Rochester, New York. Not a huge area, but there’s about a million people there. Like that’s different. So those are questions. They’re like, well, I want you to do what you did for that doctor. Well, that doctor has a million access to a million people or we have practices in Austin. She has access to 9 million people.
Like, there’s just different strategies here. Even if you’re in the same industry, then we get into different industries and it all changes. So most people come to us and that’s where the strategy starts. And so kind of what I alluded to earlier was as an engineer, I couldn’t build a boiler plant for a building and just be like, I don’t know, it feels like they need a million BTUs. I just, that seemed like I would have gotten sued into oblivion. Right. So you had to calculate based off of the building, what the load was. And that’s how much heat you gave them. And that’s what you designed to.
Well, for me it was the same thing with marketing. And so I would be like, well, where are we trying to get? Let’s work off the back. And if SEO is if, if local organic is there, if it’s accessible to me, that’s always the highest ROI. There are situations and famous situation which I fired them as clients, but I won’t name the city. A very large top ten metropolitan area in the United States. Personal injury attorneys. I said, this is what it’ll cost to compete. And they’re like, yep, we can do that. It was kind of like an ego thing with them. And I’m like, oh yeah, okay. I’m like, you have the stomach for this? They’re like, oh yeah. Yep, 100%. They in fact did not have the stomach for that.
And so I’ll be really honest and upfront with what those costs are, you know, and I’ll show you how I arrived at that. But I’m not you know, I’m not guessing. It’s not. This is not a feel good thing. This is. This is what the data says. This is how I priced it. And this is where we’re at work back.
Now to that point, I’ve had photographers come to me and she’s like, I sell this this a really weird industry. I’ve helped a couple of these photographers randomly, but I won’t even say weird. It’s unique boudoir photography. And she was in the middle of a midwest state with very little clientele. So she’s like, I want to do SEO. You did SEO for this agency in this big city. And I said, I did, but you’re not in that big city. Like, we can only run ads. And so, you know, for her, it was a different strategy.
So back to your point. Of all the things we do, yes, we do a lot of those things, but it usually is me helping to build that strategy around what is appropriate versus somebody coming in and saying, these are the things that I want. And that’s how we ended up at newsletters. So if you do send newsletters, you probably know the ins and outs of some of the technical setup, but what had happened, I hadn’t done this a while ago. I was for the supplement company. I was doing it. So I had gotten really good at sending huge mailing lists, which has gotten harder and harder and harder.
One of our medical practices they were sending, they had about 15,000 people on their email list, and they were just using their home group domain. So it was just, you know, business name.com. And they were just once a month they would just hammer it and all of a sudden their open rate, they had a good open rate just disappeared. And they’re like, what? We had, they had just moved over to us. We weren’t even doing their email yet, and we weren’t even going to do their email. And they’re like, Cameron, it’s dead. And I’m like, I’m like, well, you need that for your remarketing work. And they said, well, help. And so that’s when we started building newsletter servers.
So, you know, for the people that are listening. Rule of thumb you. If you have a list of over 2000, that’s where you want to start thinking about subdomains or secondary domains off of your main domain or your main business domain, if you’re using that for other purposes. But that’s a good rule of thumb. And then some other data behind that. Depending on who’s listening.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 23:00
You typically recommend clinics to use like an external like setting through whatever ActiveCampaign or MailChimp or a Weber or one of these types of services that kind of acts as that intermediary. So they’re not sending directly from their domain or.
Cameron LiButti: 23:18
Yeah. So we set it up on the top. We use one of those email service providers, but then we set it up custom. So it’ll be, it could be you know, could be hello Dot Business.com. So we’ll set up a subdomain and then that protects the main domain. If for whatever reason it gets marked spam. We also don’t know. We try to ask these questions, but how many emails do you send a day? The real answer is usually 30 to 40 with most businesses, but they’re like, I don’t, I don’t know.
Well, you’re sending 30 or 40 and then all of a sudden you’re hitting this, you’re hitting your mail server with, you know, 5000. That’s a signal. It’s a little off. So that’s another reason we set it up like that. And sometimes it’s hard to get access to everything that they have. So the, you know, the technical terminology, the SPF records, the deacon, the dMarc, we can control that a little better on our end with the subdomain. So that’s our preference.
A lot of the doctors just don’t want to do it either. They’ll, they’ll, they’ll write it. But they’re just like here, send it to our account manager. And she uploads it and cleans it up and makes it look good. Test it. That’s another thing. They don’t test it. They just hit send. The images aren’t rendering. The subject line isn’t right. So they you know and for us it’s the way we price it. It’s just a function of the email list. Right. So the bigger the list, the more expensive it is. That’s how we get charged through our mail servers. So that’s how we got into that. We don’t do that a ton for our clients. You know, maybe 20% of our clients do that.
But some fun data for you. We’ll see in 2025 that data isn’t out yet, but in 2024, of all of our clients, the best performing ones did both SEO and newsletter marketing, though that pair was the highest. The highest revenue practices that we worked with were those two things. It’s just and the other thing, this is another thing I’ll talk about with newsletter marketing that I think people get wrong. A website is all about the patient right when they come there or the viewer, whoever. Whatever your business is, when somebody lands on your website, it’s it’s what can you it’s all about them. The only reason you’re there is to help them. If you’re on there, if you’re listing your credentials, it’s to show them that you can help them. It’s about the reader.
Once somebody comes in and they know you, it doesn’t, your communication with them no longer has to be about the subject or the problem. So we’ll use audiology and hearing loss when they get there. They’re having a problem. Hopefully you’ve solved that problem after they’ve seen you, but at some point in time they’re going to need to come back to you and you want to remind them of that. They now have a relationship with you, I call it, you can talk about yourself at that point.
We see the best performing newsletters when it’s about you, your character. So a lot of our audiologists do nonprofit work. So we talk about that. We talk about the new people in the office that they’ve hired. They talk about their pets, for some of them. And some people are really involved in like, music, of course, that’s pretty that goes hand in hand with audiology. They talk about that. So whatever they’re into.
People love reading about they have a relationship now. It’s almost like your private social media. Once a month we send that out and we get I just looked across all of our accounts, on average we get between 50 and 60% open rate. So pretty crazy open rate doing it that way versus the old way of talking about basically taking an old blog post and putting that information in it gets a, you’re lucky to get a 20% open rate on that. Yeah.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 27:17
I want to get into the AI SEO piece, but I want to just point out a couple things. One, I just like your approach on even for the first client, like you were just trying to help add some value. Hey, this is trying to fix and most people we do the same thing. It’s like, hey, you should be doing XYZ and the right type of clients. Like I don’t want to do that. Like I want to focus on what I do and you take care of that, okay. Happy to help.
The other thing is it’s very data driven and like setting expectations. So even with the P.I., right. It’s like, listen, we’re looking at the top search or whatever has these number of backlinks. And here’s all the data. And this is what it’s going to take to produce this number of articles or whatever it is. Yeah. This is what it’s going to cost. Right. And some people say yes. And like in the end, you know, some people. Yeah, you told me this and some people forget you tell them that. And so I get that.
But there’s an expectation which is set. It’s like here’s the reality. Even if it’s a 12,000 person island versus like this is a different scenario here. And so I can see also the evolution of the services as people are asking you, you know, you’re a trusted advisor at that point. You’re like, hey, can you help with this? And things are, you know, from the AI perspective, you know, are changing people’s behaviors, right? Instead of going to Google, they’re going to ChatGPT or even within Google looking at Gemini. So what do you find mistakes in the AI SEO world and what’s working? What should people think about?
Cameron LiButti: 29:03
So the first mistake I’m finding is that people are reacting too fast. Meaning that for the first time, we jump outside of a lot of local professionals for a second because we also work with some national, large organizations. For the first time the CEOs, the CEOs, the CFOs, which those are the ones that probably, you know, are the most challenging to work with for the first time. They’re now thinking about SEO. They’re like, all we see is AI. AI. AI.
What controls AI? Oh, this AI, SEO or AI or whatever. Geo or how? There’s a million acronyms right now. And so they’re in this panic of the hype cycle, which there’s a million AI hype, right? There’s all this crazy hype around AI right now, some good, some bad. And they think they have to do this special AI, SEO and good. I don’t know if I want to call them good. Business owners see an opportunity to sell that as a service, for better or for worse. And so they’re telling them there are secrets or, you know, special ways to do this. We’ll get into tactics in a second.
But the first thing I want to point out is if you really look at the data, the search traffic that Google traditional organic search is seeing is not decreasing, but you keep hearing this number. Google search used to be 95% of traffic, then it was 92% and now it’s 90%. That is true. That is fun with numbers though, because if you look at the total search volume that is actually up, there’s just more search volume in general. So what that means is that the search engines are getting better at delivering better results, keeping people in the ecosystem delivering answers.
And so the AI portion of it is adding to it. And so that’s why it looks like the total percentage is decreasing while the AI is increasing. But the tactics that we need to think about of how this works, the bottom, this is I don’t know how familiar you are with top of funnel middle funnel bottom funnel.
Historically, top of funnel has always just been informational searches. So in the past somebody might say they might have like a tax question. They Google that tax question and they hit a tax attorney and they’re like, oh, there’s my answer. And they leave. That was great. And that person would register a hit. And everybody was, he saw some traffic. They saw, they got their answer and they moved on. Well now they’re using either AI overviews or they’re getting answered the zero click type stuff that’s happening in Google. They’re getting the answers right there.
That person was never converting anyway. I mean, very rarely where they do convert is when they start to say, you know, tax attorney Chicago, you better win that because that person is ready to buy. Now there are other type of funnel strategies. But if we’re just strictly speaking about, you know, organic, that bottom funnel search is still traveling through the paths that it’s always traveled.
You will hear people say, I got a lead from ChatGPT or this or that and that that is happening. It’s anywhere from I would say for our clients, we’re seeing about 1%. If I look at all of our form fills over the last six months, maybe 1% get tagged ChatGPT. So that shouldn’t be ignored. But then the second question is, well, what do you need to do to capture all of that and that? We want a quick history lesson that takes us back to 2015 when people weren’t paying attention to SEO.
So 2015 is when Google started to transition away from their algorithm team. So they used to have I remember the number was over 10,000 people worked at Google, and their only job was to tweak the algorithm. Every day they show up and they just turn the dials right. They would weight it and change it and they would move it. Between 2015 and 16, they transitioned to the algorithm like that happened. That is a machine. At the time we called it machine learning, but it transitioned into this machine learning algorithm. So the algorithm on the back side is always evolving. It always has been evolving. It’s evolving today.
What is changing today that’s catching everybody’s attention is what’s happening on the front side. And so the systems that you need in place are evolving, but they’re not changing at the rate that people think, because they’re equating what’s happening on the front side with user search behavior or the platforms as SEO, when the algorithm is still using the website, your citations, your Google business signals, you know, if you’re a restaurant, how many cell phones are passing through the door. All of those signals are still strong and exist, and that’s what we’re still optimizing for. And that is working to rank you on the eyes. I talk about that a lot. Did that make sense?
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 34:23
So it’s I mean what you’re saying is it’s the same fundamental things that people should be doing for SEO is what’s going to work in the AI, SEO, or whatever the term people are using?
Cameron LiButti: 34:35
Yes, correct.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 34:36
Yeah. Because basically it’s still engaging with the algorithm of search regardless. So that’s content. That’s video. That’s a lot of things that people would do to rank better from search engine side in general. Is that accurate?
Cameron LiButti: 34:53
Yeah. So some of the things we’ve noticed that it’s weighted maybe, like just slightly different on ChatGPT. If I were to be a betting person, I’m not a big better. But I do think Google Gemini will in the long run win out in this game. They have the data. They’re completely vertically integrated there. So they’re the only ones of all of the AI players that don’t use Nvidia chips. They use their own Google TV. They’re called TPUs, tensor processing units. They’re not using GPUs, so they’re vertically integrated. I truly believe they still have the best engineers there. And Gemini is if you go if you have a chance to pull up charts. But Geminis percent, if you just look at the AI search, Gemini is catching quickly. And I think that’s only going to accelerate this year. Their Gemini model, just their visual reasoning and all that is so good. I think ChatGPT or OpenAI is going to have a hard time keeping up with them this year.
And so, you know, if Google’s going to figure out how to monetize that at some point, and, you know, if you own a business or you’re marketing, you’re going to want to be in there when it happens. But, you know, Google’s not going to just let their, you know, they make money through ad revenue and they’re not going to just let that disappear. They’re going to figure out ways to integrate all of that into their ecosystem. And Google’s ads have worked.
So, you know, four years ago, Facebook was awesome. I’d say the last two years have been really bumpy for Facebook. Some people will do really well on Facebook. Some people will struggle on Facebook. But the last two years, just across the board, we’ve seen a lot of success on Google ads, which if you were to ask me three years ago, I would have told you Google ads or people kind of had learned to skip past them. People, marketers adjusted. Google adjusted. They figured out how to be, stop, I shouldn’t say that, but it’s not as spammy as it was in the past. People realize, like, we can pay for these spots. We don’t have to oversell. We can provide good value.
We used to never run paid ads to a home page, ever. Like that was like a golden rule: do not run traffic to a home page. If we design the site, we will do that now because we found, you know, it was a different user path in, you know, five years ago, you had to trap that visitor on a paid ad and you needed to convert them or you die. Where SEO, you had to let them wander. You had to let them solve the problem. And we’re finding now with the ads you can let them wander a little bit. They’ll still convert. So these are marketing strategies. You know they evolve over time. You got to be flexible.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 37:39
Yeah, Cameron. Thanks for sharing that. I did an interview. People could check it out with Nicole Donnelly who you know she travels all over talks about AI. And we basically, she has a resources page. So basically we broke down every tool that she recommended and what she liked, what she didn’t like. She’s tested all of them. And she was saying a lot of the tests they were running across any of the LMS that Gemini was winning on several accounts, you know, compared to the other ones. So you can check out the interview. I’m not going to do it justice in this brief time. But yeah, if you want to learn about more AI tools, you know, she, we break down like all the stuff she’s tested and what was working because I. I geek out on that stuff too.
On that front Cameron, I’m curious. Tech stack. Like, what are your favorite tools? Software? It could be project management. It could be, you know, pipeline tools. It could be whatever. What do you like to use as a company?
Cameron LiButti: 38:40
Well, as a company, we have our you know, we have our favorites. We are in Google Drive. Of course, you know, I, we, our business is ranking people on Google. So we use Google Drive and then we’re in ClickUp. I have a love hate relationship with all task management software.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 38:59
We use ClickUp and we like ClickUp, actually.
Cameron LiButti: 39:02
We like ClickUp. It’s been the one that’s worked the best for us. We use Slack to talk to each other. There’s 13 of us here, and then we have a handful of outside vendors, but 13 of us. The issue with the Slack ClickUp stack is that the team gets really comfortable in Slack and then projects the project. Communication is not always getting tracked in ClickUp. So that’s more of an operational thing on my end. And our chief of staff of trying to make sure people are communicating in the right places. But those yeah, those would be the things we use the most.
On websites, we build all on WordPress. Just for SEO, it’s still the most customizable. I have strong opinions on this, but anybody I’m hard pressed. If you’re not doing at least $10 million a year, you know, we can make an argument for Shopify depending on what your business is. And and but if you’re not doing $10 million a year to not have people get sold these proprietary sites and then they can’t move them, they can’t edit them. They need real developers, real developers. You need a developer, a highly paid developer to get in there. I just like these platforms that make it easy for you as a business owner to manage or own or transfer. Like you called me a consultant earlier. I take that to heart. I don’t want to own anything you do like you. You paid me for my time and you own it, right? And so we’ve run into some marketing companies that build, you know, they’ll even WordPress, but you don’t own the website. You’re renting it and they’ll throw it out when you leave. So I don’t, that’s like a big no no for me. So we’re in WordPress.
We use, our design team uses Figma. We love Figma. Love it, love it. So that’s part of our design process. We have a pretty dialed in design process now. Really good discovery. Call for what you’re looking for, who you are, what your messaging and branding and positioning. It’s a way for business owners who haven’t dealt with a marketing agency like ours. It can be a little overwhelming at first because I’m going to talk to you about like who you are. Who do you identify with, who’s your ICP ideal customer profile? A lot of these business owners under $2 million have never really thought about that. They just had a great service, or they were a doctor and they sell hearing aids or I’m a chiropractor, see whoever needs it. And then you start to identify these qualities of who you are and who your patients are. And we try to pull that out and then we go into Figma. We love Figma. It’s been to show somebody what a website’s going to look like. My wife just started her own medical, I guess we’ll call it a practice lactation consultant. And she saw Figma. She’s like, this is incredible, you know, and and and so it’s a good it’s been a good workflow.
We try not to rely too heavily on any one thing. But, you know, those are the things we do use a lot. And then on the AI side, I, my content team, we do not use ChatGPT to just push content. We are very tight. We have very strict guidelines here on how you build content, how you write content through a positioning standpoint for the practice or the business? We use ChatGPT. We give it very tight guidelines, but it helps us, right? Right. I think everybody at this point is, I talked to a lot of law firms, even they are. They’re not supposed to be, but I know they are.
And then Claude Code I’m using for my own. Me and one of my senior developers, we use it quite a bit. We build plugins and stuff like that. And then Gemini is our visual reasoning. We’re, you know, it’s I’m very good at conversion rate optimization, but to teach somebody who maybe only has, you know, 2 or 3 years how to do it helps. You can take an image of a website or, you know, even if you’re sending a mailer out, you know, and take. Give me some opinions, you still need to be the expert. I’d say, you know, 50% of the time it catches some pretty good stuff. 50% of the time it’s like, well, we didn’t do that because of X, y, Z. You don’t have that information, so you wouldn’t know that. But so we transition between the three of those quite a bit. So those would be our, our main technology.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 43:26
Yeah. You know it’s funny. That is a pet peeve of mine when people give tasks in Slack because that’s where things die. Go to die, you know, if there’s not a task. So I don’t know who set this up early on, but someone in our team set up a Slack bot. If it detects verbiage of a task, it says immediately, don’t slack me, exclamation. That’s what ClickUp is for. And so I’m not sure how we set it up originally, but I’m looking at like last week and my business partner John wrote something. Yeah. Can you start, prepare a spread blah blah blah. And then it says immediately, don’t Slack me. That’s what ClickUp is for. And so yeah, because like, we’re the ones who break the rule more than the team. Him. So anyways, maybe look into that because.
Cameron LiButti: 44:19
I will look into that.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 44:20
I’m not even sure how we set it up a long time ago, but there’s a way to do it automatically and detects it.
I want to talk about offers. Okay. Because, you know, when you were talking about the audio, you know, you’re doing paid ads, you’re doing for the audiology practices for the supplements. I’m curious. We’re going to go back to the supplements, but I want to know, like what offers worked. Like is it like a buy one get two free? Is it a discount? And then maybe we’ll talk about what are some of the ad copy that you know is working for medical practices?
Cameron LiButti: 45:03
So it depends. I hate that this is like a joke in marketing. It depends. You gotta put yourself in the position of your buyer. So where are they? How if we’re talking about medical or chiropractic, like how much pain are they in? Right? Versus if I’m thinking about marketing Bidview. They’re not in pain. They’re in discomfort. They want there’s a million things they want more money, more leads, more others.
But that trust cycle takes longer, right? So how do I build that trust? I mean, no shame in saying that’s why we do these podcasts, right? Someone can hear us talk and be like, oh, I identify with how he speaks.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 45:48
Or like, this guy kind of sounds knowledgeable. I think I’ll call him.
Cameron LiButti: 45:51
Yeah, yeah. But getting that cold email from a marketing company is the worst, right? I get them, I get them all day. I’m sure you get them all day. We get them all day long. And it’s awful. Like I don’t trust you through an email. You don’t have an offer.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 46:04
Well, not only that, just the message itself is terrible, right? It’s like.
Cameron LiButti: 46:09
Terrible.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 46:09
I’m like, how are you sending this? This can’t be working. You know what I mean? Sending up three paragraphs of what you do to someone who doesn’t know you, you know? But yeah, I mean, I guess talk supplements for a second. I’m just curious on the supplement side, what were some of the things that worked? I know we’re dusting off the cobwebs for a second and then maybe we’ll talk audiology. But what was working in Facebook at that time before they changed the.
Cameron LiButti: 46:35
They changed the rules. Yeah. So people, so we did a bunch of supplements. But the one that we knew the best was gout. So if you know anything about gout it’s extremely painful. They will pay almost any amount of money to make it stop like just make it stop. So for those who don’t know what gout is, it’s basically needle-like crystals in your joints, like actual crystals. So think about a needle inside of your big toe or your fingers. And if you move, it just stabs you. Like that is what gout is.
And so they’re in pain. They’re in so much pain. And they think there’s some secret out there, but they’ve also been scared by the pharmaceutical company. I haven’t kept up with it, but at the time, ten years ago, the pharmaceutical drugs that fixed this were nasty. Like, they had some pretty severe side effects. So they wanted to do whatever they could to stop it. And so we just were really aggressive, you couldn’t say, I can’t remember the language.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 47:46
Probably cure like something like you.
Cameron LiButti: 47:48
Could never say cure. Right. But you alluded to removing pain, right. Like delete. Like get rid of the pain. And this at the time we tested this and tested this and tested this, the ugliest, most awful landing page you have ever seen converted like it was. It was like what? There’s no. And we were good. We had good designers and we had good copy. And it was just this super long and it was just walls and walls of testimonials. And because we had them, we had so many testimonials at that point. And so it was this combination of getting rid of your pain and just proof it worked. And it did like it did.
There were some, you know, caveats about it. But, you know, if somebody was, people don’t know this. In the United States, supplements are manufactured to a 185-pound person. At least that’s how it used to be. I don’t know if they’ve changed that since it’s roughly around how it is. And so you’d get a 250 pound man like this stuff doesn’t work. It’s like, you know, if he called me, I’d be like, you can take more, but you can’t, like, legally put that on the website. But at the same point, like a hundred and, you know, 30 pound woman would be taking the, the recommended we just legally like it’s not on us even because we weren’t the manufacturer. We own the formula.
But anyway, so those were the things and then the recurring subscription was huge. We would, we were doing about one third, maybe a little more. 40% of our monthly revenue was people just would take it because they just never wanted to come back. And so it would work. To help flush the uric acid out of the uric acid is what led to those crystals. Flush that year, just month after month. So we get a lot of people on the recurring subscription we did. So we always did discounts for the recurring subscription. We gave a discount for three bottle packs. And then the main bottle, single bottle was for I want to say $40, but yeah, giving discounts free shipping at that time. Oh my gosh. If something costs and think about this psychology, you know, even for yourself today if you jump into an order form, let’s say, you know, seven more dollars for free shipping and you’ll go pay, you’ll go pay 20 more dollars for saying so. Raise the price of something to offset it. So you can say free shipping. That always works. That still works.
I again, I don’t know how many e-commerce listeners are here. I have a friend here in Chicago. I won’t, a very successful golf business, and they took all of their data. I think he used ChatGPT for it, and their understanding of the business was 100 at $100, like they were always trying to get the cart value to be $100. And so they would recommend their programming would recommend something to $100. And they threw in a ChatGPT and ChatGPT said, no, the number is 100. This is really specific. It’s $143. And he’s like this, okay, it’s so random. Fine, we’ll test it. It was $143. So they changed it to always recommend up to $143 to get your free shipping. And I forgot. He told me what the percentage of revenue increase. So whatever that order value is, find it and push it to give free. But, you know, whatever that number is, that seems to work really well. So those are some old tricks from the supplement company.
Dr. Jeremy Weisz: 51:20
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I realize one camera at the top of the hour, I just want to thank you, but this is instructive. I think for any business it’s like even whether it’s supplement, it’s medical practice, it’s legal. It’s you talked about, you focus on the pain points, right. You hit on as much proof and testimonials as possible. And that works across any industry. Right.
And so I just want to encourage people to check out BidviewMarketing.com to learn more. And Cameron this has been great. Thanks so much.
Cameron LiButti: 51:50
Thank you.
